RPS discussion topic

[Corsair5]

It doesn't generally take two weeks for a jury to find guilty or not guilty when a man's life is at stake. I doubt it'll take another week for a few rules to be finalized.

[Swift]

The two of them aren't even related in any way. One of them concerns a man's life, and the other is just an activity. LB still has school to worry about and scheduling to do. He doesn't even know when he'll be able to begin the rp. Like I said, just wait for the announcement.

[Reish Vedaur]

I *could* throw my hat into the ring if you promised not to stomp on it =P I have a combat system developed for the most part from the T1 system used in most free-form roleplaying rooms... then again, I'm not sure what direction you all are taking.

[Swift]

You can go ahead and suggest it if you want. Let LB see if he wants to use it.

[Reish Vedaur]

(This was written for something else, so some of the commentary might not apply lol)

--Classic T1--



Fighting in free-form roleplaying is quite a production.  Attacking, defending, counterattacking, spellcasting, natural abilities, psionics -- well, there's no psionics here, but you get the idea.  As someone once said, free-form RPG battles should be written as if they were ripped straight from the pages of any quality fantasy writer's published novel.  You, of course, don't have to have the same quality or vocabulary, but descriptiveness is key.  But before we cover all that, we gotta lay down some ground rules.

Rule #1: Stay within the laws of physics.  This applies to you unless you have an excuse such as, "This planet doesn't have the same physics (not acceptable here)," or "I have a special ability that allows me to fly (I'm pretty sure no one has that ability)."  If you're wearing armor, you'll move slower.  If you're wearing constricting clothing, you'll move slower.  If you're using a heavy weapon, you'll not only move slower but take slightly longer to attack and defend; there's exceptions, but you really have to know what you're talking about to have it allowed, so for the most part I'd suggest sticking with a lighter weapon and lighter armor if you intend to have a defensive strategy as well as an offensive.

Rule #2: Any injury can hinder you.  This means, just as in real life, everything from "If you've got a knick on your arm and they nudge against it, you'll feel it," to "If your gut is torn open, you're not gonna be able to think as straight either from the pain or the natural endorphins produced by your body, and have slower reaction times, not to mention the natural reaction to hold the wound."  If your arm is broken, any contact with it would have seering pain.  If your leg is broken, you could very well not be able to walk or even stand, depending on just how bad or out-of-whack it is.  If you've had a gun go off by your ear, you're not going to be able to hear a dart coming at you (I do remember a roleplay where someone tried that on me).

Rule #3: Anything can alter your current status, position and facing, under the correct circumstances.  That includes bullets, swords, knives, teeth, fists, fingers, claws, rocks and gravel, sets of keys, -- even dryer lint fired from an air cannon.  Okay, let me explain;  even if you were an invincible creature (which isn't allowed, so stop that train of thought right there), if someone strong hit you in the jaw, it might not hurt you, but your head would move with the man's fist.  If you're in a fight and someone throws their hat in your face, it will either distract you or block your field of vision more and more as it approached.  If someone had no weapon so they smack you in the face with their set of keys, it'll claw your face up -- just cuz they're not a weapon doesn't mean they won't hurt you.

Rule #4: Speaking of invincible creatures, there can be no "god moders" or "Mary-Sue's."  Those are the utmost worst characters in any free-form roleplay.  What are they?  God moders have powers beyond anyone else's, cannot be killed (or have no weaknesses whatsoever), and can easily destroy the world if it were their whim.  Mary-Sue characters are those that can seemingly do everything that so happens to come into their path, whether it be to clearcut a forest, follow tracks in leaves, darn some socks, heal an injured character, ignite something on fire with their mind, forge a sword worthy of kings, cook a world-class meal, and still have room for whatever skills they miraculously gain by being presented any problem.

Rule #5: No one is perfect.  Learn to foul up every now and then; whether intentional or accidental, you should learn to accept it and get on with it.  You'll have plenty of time and perhaps plenty of other characters later on.

Alright, by now you should have a good idea of what we're looking for.  Now to give you the structure of the battles themselves...

There are five basic actions in battle: positioning, preparing, attacking, defending, and declaring damage.
-- Positioning is declaring where you are or where you are headed.  Examples include standing in the field defensively facing your opponent, charging at the opponent, retreating away from your opponent... Notice, in all examples, the position is always given relative to the opponent.  This is not necessary but it is very useful, especially when reviewing a battle later on.
-- Preparing is what you do to begin to use a special ability; things like movements done while casting a magic spell.
-- Attacking is quite obvious, but it could also be the declaration of a spell being cast.  You'll never tell the defending player whether or not the attack hits; that is for them to decide.  It may be disputed if the attack doesn't seem to have been defended against well enough.
-- Defending is also quite obvious.  Dodging, blocking, dissipating or otherwise avoiding an attack's damage through any means.
-- Declaring damage is done by you when your opponent hits you, using your judgment of your opponent's attack to decide what damage they actually did.  The amount of damage declared by you may be disputed by the attacker if it turns out you didn't understand the intent of the attack.  Let me make one thing clear, though; you never declare the other person's damage for them.  You may suggest the damage, but you may not say that it is in fact exactly what happens to them.

There is no real structure in the order of which you must do these, until you get out there and fight yourself.  However, the first post in a battle, unless their position is stated otherwise through prior roleplay, is always started with positioning your character.

We will now demonstrate some of what we've been telling you in a quick fight scene.

First battle:

* Jintao sits at the end of the bar, ordering a rose wine from the barkeep and drawing his hair behind his elven ear.
* Berhet at the other end of the bar watches, growling and muttering, "Contemptable elves."
(You'll notice that their positions have been declared already by prior roleplay.)
* Jintao, being an elf, has a heightened sense of hearing, and clearly hears Berhet.  His eyes narrow and he glances at him, hand slipping into his jacket pocket, taking a shuriken ((japanese throwing star)) between two of his fingers.
(Now Jintao is preparing...)
* Berhet, his eyes still on Jintao, watches his movements and grasps one of the bottles on his belt, pulling it out and immediately throwing it straight for Jintao.
(You'll notice I didn't say he threw it at Jintao, shattering agaisnt him as it struck him.. that's against the rules, as Jintao may still defend)
* Jintao quickly leans backward in his stool, practically backflipping behind the stool, the bottle whizzing past him, hand flicking out from his pocket and throwing the shuriken straight for Berhet's neck.
(That was a defense with a counterattack)
* Berhet ducks, the shuriken grazing the back of his head, drawing blood.  He stands up angrily, grabbing another bottle from his belt and throwing it at the floor in front of Jintao.  This time, it wasn't a dud.  The bottle was actually an alchemical formula mixed as it shattered from two seperate sections of the bottle.  Its reaction is volitile, and it explodes.
(It didn't hit Jintao directly, mind you; it hit the floor in front of his position at that time assuming he'd not moved yet.  Also note how the damage on Berhet was declared.)
* Jintao, unknowing of the formula of the bottle, mearly put his hand on the hilt of his sword.  As it exploded, it sent Jintao careening across the floor of the bar, the concussion from the blast giving him a nosebleed, and the glass embedding itself into various parts of his body.  He stands up drearily, limping as one shard has severed part of the tendon in his right knee, glaring at the blurry image of Berhet over on the far side of the bar.
(Note all the damage dealt to Jintao from a single attack; also note that he, an elf and a professional assassin, actually did screw up, and has paid dearly for it)



--T1 Revision J--



Okay, so, there were actually two revisions of the battle system.. but one of them was for a competition only, so..

There are different combinations you can do during your turn, however, there's limits as to how many you can do. You can do as much as you like, so long as there is only one attack or counterattack. There is also the ability to interrupt, meaning if you want to you may attack while they are attacking, thus forcing them to defend and negating their attack.  An interrupt counts as an attack, of course.

Also, at the end of the turn, you must state exactly what it is the attack is meant to do. This doesn't mean that's what it definitively will do, just that it's what the character means to do.

Any spells or special abilities used must be done in one post, with a description of how each step takes place and about how long the whole process takes; based on this the defender can use an interrupt, depending of course if they are in range or have the time to do so.

Other than that, it's T1.

[Corsair5]

Impressive...most impressive.

[Guest]

Getting a bad feeling about the RPS.

[Swift]

Could you elaborate please, Jigen?

[Corsair5]

Yeah, I get bad feelings all the time. Like, when I consider slamming my fist down on a nail, I get a bad feeling that it would hurt.

[Jigen]

A man of copious intelligence considers slamming his fist down on a nail, wonders never cease.

But to elaborate my bad feeling mostly comes from a fighting system that completely ignores conditioning and experience. Sure a bunch of plebs fighting each other can't block out pain or press on despite the agony generated by their wounds but there are plenty of examples of it happening in RL. That doesn't mean that a character should be able to simply ignore their pain whenever they get hurt, but more that, if the situation warrants it, the character isn't immediately going out of action just because they've been hurt. That and a lot of the other elements to this system are just common sense spelled out in front of us.

That and a person who is used to wearing heavy armour becames strong enough to move with something approaching swiftness. The only reason heavy armour is thought to be restrictive is because it's adding an extra 20-30 kilos to your body when you move. Put that on somone who doesn't normally wear armour and it becomes a major encumbrance. Get them to practice in that armour every day for a year and it becomes less so. Same thing goes for heavy weapons.

And actually having a rule that requires us to pre-set our 'mistakes' is kind of weird, don't we make enough mistakes just through miscommunication and lack of paying attention as it is (I know I do).

I'm not dissing Reish, I'm sure he has good reason for implimenting a system where I personally don't see the need for it. It's just that this is supposed to be on-the-fly sort of game where we can be more inventive in our solutions rather than following a system that favours one kind of approach over another. I always prefer the 'one rule' system. That one rule being, 'What the Game Master says, goes.' Then it's just a matter of picking a fair GM.

 

[Corsair5]

Jig, you really think conditioning matters that much when you've got a spearpoint through your upper leg? You're GOING to limp, like it or not.

[Reish Vedaur]

"There is an exception to every rule, including this one."  First off, at no point did I make it a rule that characters can't be a thick-hided strongarm whose trained in heavy armor for quite awhile.  Regardless, it takes not only a lot of training but also high-quality armor to get the same flexibility as a person fighting without it; otherwise, it would be like fighting in a parka.  Even thought it is true that most plate armor is actually lighter than modern-day body armor given to soldiers (40 pound vest plus optional though often mandatory 20 pounds of armor slips inside of it), it is also true that plate armor has joints while modern day armor is entirely flexible, save for the abdomen.

Rule #1 is to take physics into account and not deviate from them.  If you are using plate armor and a broadsword, and you're trying to do a complicated maneuvre, you're probably going to do it a bit slowly or fail at it.  There is very little conditioning that can prevent that.  That's why chain mail exists.

Pointing out technicalities doesn't really get us anywhere, and yes, it is a lot of common sense, but if you've ever roleplayed where I have you realize common sense is often a commodity so things like this have to be spelled out, and others have to be ruled out because of abuse.  For instance, I once got into a fight with someone who was floating, and he happened to be the GM.  I performed a move that was a lot like a jump kick and he ruled that, because of physics (and his misunderstanding of a certain rule), the kick did nothing because I had nothing to push off of, regardless of how much I tried to explain to him the concept of a jump kick was the same as the concept of a bullet or arrow.  Common sense is often overlooked for a character's well-being, and that's what the system tries to prevent.

Where on earth does this system ignore conditioning and experience?  The ability to argue your case, and the fact that your character is the way he is (including their conditioning and experience), are both part of this system and they are in fact integral to it.  I genuinely don't see where your problem with it lies.

[Jigen]

if you've ever roleplayed where I have you realize common sense is often a commodity

Can't argue with that.

I can see where you're comming from now Reish (bitter, hard-won experience) so I get what you're doing.

What I don't see Corsair is where I said you weren't going to limp.

 

[Corsair5]

You were chattering on about conditioning and such. Besides, Platemail was evenly distributed around your body, so a grown man who wasn't crippled or otherwise impaired and was in pretty good shape could move around fairly easily in it. There's many examples of knights running, mounting, doing cartwheels, even, in platemail.

[Jigen]

Yes, you're right, I was prattling on about conditioning and such. I never said, nor implied that any ammount of conditioning could allow someone to operate with total normality after having their thigh impaled by with spear.